^Ripper's Anime Page

So yeah, uh, phase 94... Wow.

Going back and rereading my old Viz volumes, and reevaluating Elf and Zwolf and the roles they play reeeally makes you think about a couple things. (Other than, y'know, "Raped... to death. Dang.") Elf and Zwolf were like the first and boldest example of the shonen manga flavor that sets LO apart from the first series. (Not to downplay the massively multivolume fighting tourney, nor Zekka and... everything he does ) Seriously Elf and Zwolf were like an unabashed engine of fanservice generation. The innuendo-speak, the bunny suits, their gratingly cuteypie worthlessness in a fight... the list goes on. They seemed like characters from an entirely different series. Kishiro however, not being a hack, handled them as deftly as characters like that coulda been handled in the Alitaverse, but jeez did they seem out of place.

Now, though, the tournament is winding down, there's all that sinister Angel of Mars stuff looming, bigtime political machinations are underway with Ladder, the Scrapyard, AND Mars Kingdom Parliament. The plot is tightening up and the tone overall seems to be taking a shift towards the darker. Even Sechs is all set up for a character defining Alita vs Jashugan style fight with Zekka... who could himself conceivably end up either written out or developed into a more nuanced personality within the next couple chapters. IF Kishiro brings E&Z back, you'd figure they're gonna have to be either intensely traumatized or hardened or matured in SOME way by the whole experience. What do you think?

BTW That image of what's left of Elf and Zwolf answered a big question I had about Rakkan's attempted "rape strike" on Alita in Volume 12. I was thinking, "How is it rape when you impale someone in the sternum with your hand...?"
I guess he's not that picky...?

Megan_Gale wrote:So yeah, uh, phase 94... Wow.

Going back and rereading my old Viz volumes, and reevaluating Elf and Zwolf and the roles they play reeeally makes you think about a couple things. (Other than, y'know, "Raped... to death. Dang.") Elf and Zwolf were like the first and boldest example of the shonen manga flavor that sets LO apart from the first series. (Not to downplay the massively multivolume fighting tourney, nor Zekka and... everything he does ) Seriously Elf and Zwolf were like an unabashed engine of fanservice generation. The innuendo-speak, the bunny suits, their gratingly cuteypie worthlessness in a fight... the list goes on. They seemed like characters from an entirely different series. Kishiro however, not being a hack, handled them as deftly as characters like that coulda been handled in the Alitaverse, but jeez did they seem out of place.

Now, though, the tournament is winding down, there's all that sinister Angel of Mars stuff looming, bigtime political machinations are underway with Ladder, the Scrapyard, AND Mars Kingdom Parliament. The plot is tightening up and the tone overall seems to be taking a shift towards the darker. Even Sechs is all set up for a character defining Alita vs Jashugan style fight with Zekka... who could himself conceivably end up either written out or developed into a more nuanced personality within the next couple chapters. IF Kishiro brings E&Z back, you'd figure they're gonna have to be either intensely traumatized or hardened or matured in SOME way by the whole experience. What do you think?

BTW That image of what's left of Elf and Zwolf answered a big question I had about Rakkan's attempted "rape strike" on Alita in Volume 12. I was thinking, "How is it rape when you impale someone in the sternum with your hand...?"
I guess he's not that picky...?

I'm pretty sure I REALLY like you. I'm not sure I have much else to offer on this topic, but I'm happy this manner of discussion has developed as a result.

Remember, Elf and Zwolf are both facets of Alita's personality. After Alita went through her ordeal as a tuned, fell in love with figure, and got blown up by Nova, she matured a bit and lost some of her mischievous side. Elf and Zwolf were introduced right at that time to keep that irreverent humor in the manga. I'm sure that they'll be rebuilt (maybe to not be so worthless any more?) Kishiro just didn't want to have to write a joke fight into the finals for them. In fact, I really enjoy the dynamic between Alita, her clones, Ping, and Nova (they do still have a copy of him floating around, don't they?). Reverting to Alita by herself like it was for most of the first half of the manga would be a step backwards in my opinion.

I love the bunnies. I demand Rakan to be sluaghtered! Heil, Zazie!

Sergio wrote:I love the bunnies. I demand Rakan to be sluaghtered! Heil, Zazie!

I second the notion and demand their comeback!
Rakan must have pawned them by surprise and from behind.

Thanks Twitchywrote!

TargaryenX, I hadn't really thought of that. It's an interesting thing to consider what ANYONE would do if they were abruptly dropped into the world as an adult, with an adult double of themselves, who shares your memories... an unabashedly insular relationship would probably form pretty naturally. And yea, The GIB did roll that dice 11 times, so to speak, so you'd figure that odds would eventually produce an Alita clone with only marginal interest in warrior living.
They do bring out some great moments w/the other characters, I gotta say. Crabby Alita at the MIB core telling them, "Don't act all chummy!!" then embarrassing Alita at the onion frame lounge with the questionable karaoke performance, all the myriad death threats from Sechs, et cetera. And yeah, I do dig the dynamic of the group. I wanna see Ping come back, even though it would majorly Marvel Comics of Kishiro to be that cheap... sigh.

What do you figure transpired offscreen when Zazie found the dead bunnies? Think the others know and are saving it for after the fight?
Think they even know?? Zazie's unpredictable w/that crippling social anxiety and all, but corpses in your bathroom are a pretty big thing to not mention, I'd think! Of course, so is the prospect of DYING and that didn't loosen her tounge--! (Y'know that bit by the vending machine w/Elf and Zwolf was pretty priceless, too, come to think of it.)

I bet at some point we're going to get an introspective moment w/Sechs over them, especially when you consider he PERSONALY offed ALL OF THE OTHER GIB CLONES IN COLD BLOOD. It's going to have to create at least a little internal conflict...!

I hope Zazie vs Rakkan gets good screen time. I want to see Zazie kick ass one on one. And I want very badly to see Rakkan die.

Megan_Gale: great topic! I hope you'll be around here for a long time!!

I think (brace yourself, bunny-fans) that Zwölf is dead. Her Kimji-fluff looks pretty damaged, while you can see little lines of trembling movement around the other Kimji (actually they are Kemji and Komji or something^^).
And with Alita creeping around in the ventiducts the hours before the match, I kinda assume that she knows already but at the moment she seems to be in a state of emptyness-of-mind. Maybe it is the Zen, but since I don't now nothing about Zen, I'll do better in keeping my mouth shut about that. Kishiro will tell us anyway .
Sechs however should've been too occupied and agitated because of the upcomming match so I think she don't know it yet. And Zazie is the shy and silent one. She didn't even have the heart to tell Alita about the Verschlag in her head. (after what the bunnies made their proposal^^).

It should be a matter of ways how Zazie kills Rakan (well it would be totally uncool, no, impossible for the story to let Rakan win...). I like the idea of Rakan being infected with berserker-cells but we already had this developement with Barietsu/Warjets. So Zazie has to pull some other nice trick out of her sleeve and she has to do it quick, since Rakan seems to be rather fast and agile (---> shotgun? Her Zanber K90 is equipped with that ). Next chapter should be her fight/ screentime, I'm pretty eager now!

About the bunnies in general: I didn't / don't like them that much and am a bit glad they are gone actually. Like said before, they had some funny interaction and even fought and won some fights but all in all the're no good. Their personality is made in a way, that they can't develope per se (otherwise it wouldn't be the bunnies anymore but a clone of Sechs) and their weapon is a strict "win or lose"-thing. Either the enemy is cut to pieces in an instant or he has a powerful counter, making the molecular wires impossible and thus rendering the bunnies defenseless (so what I wanted to say is there is no modification of the wire, its just "cut" or "no cut").

I wanna see Ping come back, even though it would majorly Marvel Comics of Kishiro to be that cheap... sigh.

Oh Ping is still alive. He had planned from the start to amputate his limbs as an emergency measure after all, naturally he wouldn't let that kill him. His doctor girlfriend from Leviathan I is reviving him.

http://mangahelpers.com/s/imaginos-scan ... e/60332/20

Also, there's nothing to say that Elf and Zwolf (If she's still alive) can't learn to use a different weapon. Alita never had a Titan blade after all. They don't need to develop as characters to serve their purpose (which is to be annoying little sisters), although if Zwolf died I doubt Elf would be the same afterwards, it would be interesting to see.

Re: Ping being brain damaged: Are you saying Porta-Nova was somehow not to be trusted...? Ha ha, good point.
It would rule to see Elf live to try to find herself as an personality independant of Zwolf. I mean the message of the whole damn series is about living your own life as your own person, and Alita (and her other surviving double Sechs) are relentlessly doing exactly that.
Hey, and Kishiro DID also give her the less than pinup-worthy faceplate after the Space Cult fight... it might totally follow that he's had other plans for her since at least then.
The most logical way I can immediately think of to develop her past that point in a way that sets her apart from Sechs would probably be to do something like Kishiro did with Shumira (that cuteypie third-person-speaking shonen archetype of yore!)
Get her completely out of the fighting scene and maybe into a more civilian capacity. Something nurturing perhaps (Alita's always had that in her)
...oh hell, maybe she'll end up with Guntroll?

(wild speculation abounds )

ps This forum rules. I'm so glad this exists. Thank you Rippers Anime, I thought Alita fandom was a giant empty void until I stumbled across you all!!)

So far I don't think we'll see the bunnies fight again. I could see Kishiro pull us the same thing that he did with Shumira, making them go away (Zalem or Kutzutestu would be possible), and get a "normal" life of their own.
Zazie vs Rakan seems interesting so far. So far, as an experience military who saw a lots of dirty fights and wars, I could see Zazie having some flashback about rape/female abuse during the whole fight. I think she'll win, but that's not gonna be easy. Maybe end heavily enjured.
Another joke about her fight being completely ignored by the media in favor of Zechs/Zekka or Gally/Toji would be a good way to lighten up the thing (I'm not keen on rape stories personally).
I really like Zazie anyway, so any developement Kishiro has for her is welcome.

Dream wrote:(I'm not keen on rape stories personally).

So we are two. Rapists offend my dignity as a male.

Yeah, Toji did a crap job overseeing the formation of the Space Karate Allies, or whatever they are. For the record I hate the Karate Forces. Planet Karate sounds like it's gonna be a real awesome place when you figure you got a famous serial rapist/murderer in the founding fathers roster. Even what's his name, the thoroughly uninteresting crab dude who's written out already, thought Toji was a few Legos short of a playset on the whole concept. Let's visualize this. Like that bit a few phases ago when Pam and Nola are trying to wrap their heads around the idea of Tiphares as part of this brilliant idea for a sepratist nation... "Would we all have to learn karate?"
I don't know about that, girls, but I tell you what, when nighttime comes around you lock your doors turn out the lights pull down the shades and say a Hail Mary... Prime Minister Rakkan is "campaigning" for YOU!!

God I can't wait till he's over.

I'd love it if Elf had to go on by her own, losing her "twin sister" has to make her a little bit more serious(depressed)

Butt I think Raikan will die utterly in the hands of Zazie, maybe after some damage to Zazie. Well... I'll saw Alita Vs Zekka in
the end with some kind of twist. It's the only reasonable solution due to the power levels... I think

yaawn after long time returning to the loable forum, I recently catched up from chapter 79 my goodnes so much things happened and soo fas well I demmand at least one bunny back that why I bought two of 'em XD ... and Zazie FTW

Well, I'm again with you, guys. I've finally read everything currently available, so now I can participate in topics related to the manga itself without worrying about spoilers. Next time I'll read the whole BAA+LO will be after a year from today, so I'll stop attending most of the topics again soon.

But for now I'd like to express some of impressions about the tone of LO.


First, the main character - Alita. As it goes, she isn't a main character anymore - this is not right at all.

Starting from the LOv5 to 10 YK was leading us away from her, switching attention to anything except her as frequently as possible. This is understandable, he was developing other characters and their backgrounds, while keeping Alita a bit aside, but still as the MAIN CHARACTER.
Even if there were the whole volumes (Caerula's story) with her at the second plan, they were needed as a revelation, expanding the YK's universe.

Also, I guess, he was building up attention shift to strike the reader in the v10 with the brainchip plot twist. That's logical, I've nearly had a heart attack while reading v10. I thought that after v10 he will focus on Alita again and will lead the story binding it to that event and developing it further.

But what he did was cutting that branch of the plot line and completely building the story around Sechs, Zekka, and others, completely discarding the brainchip plotline and even omitting Nova after the v12!
This is sad and unforgivable! What about her brain? How is he going to get away with that? That's the most interesting and important part starting from v10 and it's dropped!

After bc-Alita's return, she's stopped being the main character!
Whoever else, but not her - attention is scattered across all the actors, she only seldomly appears as a side-character from now on! Moreover, YK has completely alienated her, he has completely removed all the soul from her, and stripped her of emotive side completely. Even her face has changed dramatically, and she has got a completely ridiculous tail which I hate!

Also, I don't like how YK overexaggerates her cat similarities now. Why did he introduce the beheavioral changes to her (like using ventillation shafts instead of doors), is a complete mystery to me.

I don't like the new Alita at all, and the story has lost it's impact on me completely.

I guess, the next plot direction after ZOTT will be about Mars, but what about the brain? That's the only question bothering me since v10.



Ok, let's switch to this stopic's subject - Elf and Zwolf and their death.
I don't see anything bad about removing them. They were appropriate as Nova's bodyguards, but not for the ZOTT.

Original BAA used to be a serious story not allowing humor, but at the LO they're something like an idiotic clownish side of Alita detached from her.

I'm not happy of the way YK has eliminated them, I despise rapists.
But we have to THANK YK FOR NOT SHOWING IT IN-DETAIL, just as a one-picture flashback. If he did that, it would ruin the purity of the whole series completely and forever! I have forgiven him for the Anomaly and it's... khm... "cannon", but the rape scene would be absolutely unforgivable!

However, their bunny suits were really annoying and ridiculous. The only thing left to wish is for YK to get rid of Alita's tail, which is another ridiculous and annoying thing.

I don't understand why some people in this forum shout "I like the tail! It's amazing! ^^". Adoring the zoomorphic humans/antropomorphic animals is sick, and people who like them are at least deviative!
I understand that some of them are appropriate if they aren't introduced for amusement - Homme du Feu or the BAAv2 werewolf for example. But not this, this is retarded.



In conclusion, I'd like to say that something bad is happening to LO - it will be never the same for me from now on, it has split into "before v10" and "after v10".

It's a monthly manga, I wouldn't expect it to move so quickly. This is all part of the same arc, it's not like YK just cut off the storyline from v10, it's just taking a long time to resolve it because this tournament keeps getting in the way.

Also, don't forget you're getting older. If you're young much things have a far greater impact on you and as you grow up, your world gets more and more defined. Or at least you think that. In reality, the world is still complicated, our brains just stop learning and thinking so much as they used to until we are-- 20 or maybe 30. After that its only a long way downhill (but note: I don't know how old you really are and of course there are exceptions^^)

As for Alitas "new" personality: I too think that all this will change back to "our" Alita after a while or after a certain event (maybe getting her brain back). Don't forget that this manga greatly deals with psychology. This isn't a new characteristic trait of Alita, it's more likely a huuuge act of repression and fear (what am I telling you, knowing your taste of literature, I think you know by far more than I do^^). Momentarily Alita only lives for the fight and for "the others that need her", but what after the ZOTT? She will collapse once more and after that it's the real Alita again. Imo

Cailon wrote:Also, don't forget you're getting older.

That is a sad truth. When we are ten, a year lasts an eternity; when we are twenty, it is sensibly faster. A eighty-year-old person knows death is near because time is just a wink.

That makes me ask: in a word where Methuselyzation took place, how would people feel?

People would 't hurry for anything

Eternity lies beyond ? time for some afterthougths-free lazyness

HumanRage wrote:People would 't hurry for anything

My question was incomplete, as I naïvely thought the meaning was clear.
I was wondering how someone living, for example, 800 years would feel the time passing, as each year it seems to go faster.

By the way, in real world, nanotechnology is believed to be common in fifty years (according to History Channel), and people are supposed to live 1,000 years. Wow! Will we be blessed with such a scientific miracle?

It will happen, either be from DNA "no cell die" patch, or nanotech of somesort (may it be external, like rejuvenate you every once in a while)

As a matter of fact, i'm quite ready for this, and i'm not afraid to live 5000 years, as long as other people benefit from it and it will not be a doom like "you'll bury the ones you love, 50 times hahahahahaha" or shit like that
but i'm afraid we born late enough to see it possible and understand the in and outs, but too soon so we won't be able to benefit from that, unless serious world revolution and internet-wide maelstrom of ideas.

My guess is :
- some people will be afraid, like toying with gods realm and will collapse/refuse it.
- some people will go "hell yeah !" and later collapse from repeated grief or die from lack of careness, relying too much on tech
- some wise ones will live to see the times to come

choose your side


edit : i love these kind of wild concepts thoughts

Well, members of Mars Kingdom Parliament prefer to live and die without nancotech.

Then there is the idea that even if you can revitalize your body to live for thousands of years, the mind itself will eventually grow unstable and dim, like a computer that's been running for too long.

Sergio wrote:That makes me ask: in a word where Methuselyzation took place, how would people feel?

I think, the subjective time will freeze with the speed it had when one took MT, or just will be still accelerating, but a lot slower. I don't think it depends on experience or lifespan, it depends on how much you give it a thought.

Anyway, there are methods to decrease it's speed, but they're quite... uncomfortable. For example, try looking at the clock each 5 minutes and say "Fuck, it's xx:xx already! ". It's important to synchronize the inner/subjective clock with the real ones.

Also, another method is to try to count exactly one minute as precise as possible, CONSTANTLY, NON-STOP. You won't last even 5 minutes, you will forget that you're counting right now - the subjective time will go as it used to. But while you were counting, that moment will last a lot longer.

Another thing is - when you're scared, subjective time slows down or even stops. I'm death afraid of flights, but I'll have to do it on this Friday and then two weeks later. If I won't die there, that flights will feel like eternity.

Sergio wrote:By the way, in real world, nanotechnology is believed to be common in fifty years (according to History Channel), and people are supposed to live 1,000 years. Wow! Will we be blessed with such a scientific miracle?

Ray Kurzweil wrote that it will be generally available about 2025. I really hope that and count on it.
However, if it will happen that time, it will only be available in the science leading countries and will come to others with additional 10 years per eschelon.

What about my country, the science is nearly dead here now and it's dying further. Everything created in USSR is lost or sold, government only pretends to promise care about science. You won't beleive this, but a physics/matematician/whatever PROFESSOR (you can call it PhD if you like) gets a salary of about 350$ a month, if he's lucky. A teacher at the university gets about 250+about 50 as bonuses. That's a shame.

However, researches about technology of raw material extraction (gas, oil, coal, and so forth) are greatly funded, because economics is based on raping the resourses. The saddest thing about it is that the resource deposits are in fact owned by the oligarchy, which has fused with the government, instead of the nation.

Nearly no high-tech is produced, these projects are needed just for stealing the budget money. The most recent example - the nanotech research.

About a year ago, there was a huge propaganda going about development of the nano technology, even the government corporation "Rosnano" was founded and about 1 BILLION $ were invested by the government. The year later, it has just disappeared with all it's money. Nearly no researches were done, if there were researches, they were a fake ones - just to pretend that "we are doing something".

The funniest thing is - after that, the functionary, who was the head of the company, was summoned by the prime minister to answer where did the money go, how they were used, and so on. His answer was simple: "They've DISAPPEARED! ". The prime minister was furious, but that functionary wasn't even punished. AT ALL. The guy has just stolen 1 bil $ and got away with it. COMPLETELY.
I don't know about other countries, where pulling such a thing will, most probably, lead to a realllly loooong inprisonment or just execution, he wasn't even stripped of his post. Now he is in the Forbes list, and also in the government.

The story is really funny, even if it's griefly sad - 90% of the functionaries are like him, this has became really common, not to mention. It's even taken for granted by everyone, no one even tries to hide it.

This thing is everywhere, just in different scale. Even in the university I'm studying in this is really obvious. About 2-3 years ago I've seen some teachers bursting in envy when they discovered that I was earning ten times more than they did. That is really sad and shameful.

I don't want to continue this topic further.


Also, to make everything completely clear.

I know that this can confuse most you, or seriously disappoint, but I'll say it. I think, I'm a lot younger than you guys (I expect most of you to be about 25 or so, and about 35-37 for Sergio).

I'm 20 and a half right now, I read lots of crazy books (which most of people don't beleive I've read - they say they're impossible to understand) - you know my preferences, and I look like a heavy drug junkie due to working nearly non-stop, still sparing some time for several hobbies I have.
Also I'm completely sociophobic and ex-communicated person. However, I have a girlfriend, which looks some similar to Alita without her knowing it.

I think, you feel uncomfortable now - to overestimate me all that time. Anyway, I'm just curious - how really did you estimate my age?

Money disappearing in Brazil is routine. The present government even innovated, as many bought deputies were caught carrying money in bags. I believe you must have seen/read this, as it was reported all around the planet (or even on Mars, Venus and Jupiter).

I am not a scientist. Far from that. I edit didactic books and work as an English-Pertuguese translator.