The idea of scalar waves is pretty cool and has been getting a lot of attention in this series lately. But look anywhere and no self respecting scientist will endorse it. So why did BAA, a hard SF series go all crackpot?
Background info for those who don't know:
The theory is this: There is energy out there, well there is energy literally everywhere. But it exists not in the form space or mass but rather time. That time itself is compressed energy just like how mass is compressed energy (hence E=mc ^2).
It has a nice ring to it, since space time is essentially the same thing but by its very definition it can't be measured by any physical means. The only "proof" is that even in complete vacuum with background radiation taken out you still have what is known as "vacuum energy". This is what Mbadi was talking about when he mentioned the D-ripper theory.
Honestly I'm amazed YK even knows such a fringe theory and incorporated it into his manga. I'm not sure I like that it is SUCH a big part of his work though. He usually sticks to more established theoretical physics rather than conspiracy theories. I mean, with all the wormhole reactors and antimatter and blackhole punches, you'd think he could base the SoD on more practical/hard sciences right?
What do you guys think?
Scalar waves??
Moderator: crazyankan
Re: Scalar waves??
What does "SoD" or "the SoD" stands for?you'd think he could base the SoD on more practical/hard sciences right?
Art of making photos is mesured by spended time in photoshop. More means WORSE..
Re: Scalar waves??
Sword of Damocles.CharyOdd wrote:What does "SoD" or "the SoD" stands for?you'd think he could base the SoD on more practical/hard sciences right?
The Abaddon in the first serie was also a scalar weapon, used for Zalem's auto defense. scalar waves are also linking jeru and the onion frame together
Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes. (Oscar Wilde)
Corporations have no soul to save, and they have no body to incarcerate. (Baron Thurlow)
Corporations have no soul to save, and they have no body to incarcerate. (Baron Thurlow)
Re: Scalar waves??
Scale waves are also the basis of the 3 battle stance, the d-ripper theory to use the energy of the vacuum is also an application of scalar theory.
For something that has absolutely no basis in reality, it sure makes a large foundation for this series. Even Don Fua's ability to make himself non corporeal is more realistic since it has some (albeit tenuous) basis in proven physics.
For something that has absolutely no basis in reality, it sure makes a large foundation for this series. Even Don Fua's ability to make himself non corporeal is more realistic since it has some (albeit tenuous) basis in proven physics.
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TankTreads
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Re: Scalar waves??
There's nothing wrong with using pseudoscience in a work of fiction. I mean, most of the "science" in Stein's Gate was based on conspiracy theories as well. That didn't keep it from being an awesome franchise.
Yes, scalar waves and free vacuum energy are bunk, but that shouldn't stop people from going over the "what-if" scenarios and envisioning the potential military applications of these principles as if they were real. Actually, if I recall correctly, the first series literally made reference to the "Hutchison Effect", which, of course, refers to John Hutchison, who is well-known in physics circles as a crackpot. This same strand of conspiracy theories is related to HAARP, the Philadelphia Experiment and various claims that the KGB had stolen Nikola Tesla's documents and used them to create all manner of electromagnetic weaponry. Tesla-style weaponry in science fiction is hardly a new idea, anyway.
There are real EMR weapons out there, but they're big, clunky and short-ranged, like the Raytheon ADS. All of these conspiracy theories rely on the assumption that there is some unknown physical principle that allows you to bypass the flux density issues with conventional electromagnetic-frequency weapons and deliver tremendous amounts of energy to distant targets; enough to vaporize a tank from miles away, even without line-of-sight, using waves that can somehow miraculously pass through any intervening materials. Some of these conspiracy theorists would have you believe that a car could be melted down from miles away by a device no larger than a kitchen appliance; at least Yukito Kishiro makes it semi-plausible by depicting these weapons as skyscraper-sized or larger.
Strictly speaking, BAA has never been "hard" SF to begin with. If it were truly "hard", we wouldn't have things like plasma punches and running along grind-cutters. Even the simple Newtonian physics in the series are pure fantasy. If an actual cyborg attempted any of the stunts you see in BAA, their limbs would explode. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. When one's punches start exceeding tens of kilojoules of impact energy, you start pushing the limits of what your augmented body's materials can do. That's why even ultra-dense depleted uranium penetrators partially fragment on impact.
Yes, scalar waves and free vacuum energy are bunk, but that shouldn't stop people from going over the "what-if" scenarios and envisioning the potential military applications of these principles as if they were real. Actually, if I recall correctly, the first series literally made reference to the "Hutchison Effect", which, of course, refers to John Hutchison, who is well-known in physics circles as a crackpot. This same strand of conspiracy theories is related to HAARP, the Philadelphia Experiment and various claims that the KGB had stolen Nikola Tesla's documents and used them to create all manner of electromagnetic weaponry. Tesla-style weaponry in science fiction is hardly a new idea, anyway.
There are real EMR weapons out there, but they're big, clunky and short-ranged, like the Raytheon ADS. All of these conspiracy theories rely on the assumption that there is some unknown physical principle that allows you to bypass the flux density issues with conventional electromagnetic-frequency weapons and deliver tremendous amounts of energy to distant targets; enough to vaporize a tank from miles away, even without line-of-sight, using waves that can somehow miraculously pass through any intervening materials. Some of these conspiracy theorists would have you believe that a car could be melted down from miles away by a device no larger than a kitchen appliance; at least Yukito Kishiro makes it semi-plausible by depicting these weapons as skyscraper-sized or larger.
Strictly speaking, BAA has never been "hard" SF to begin with. If it were truly "hard", we wouldn't have things like plasma punches and running along grind-cutters. Even the simple Newtonian physics in the series are pure fantasy. If an actual cyborg attempted any of the stunts you see in BAA, their limbs would explode. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. When one's punches start exceeding tens of kilojoules of impact energy, you start pushing the limits of what your augmented body's materials can do. That's why even ultra-dense depleted uranium penetrators partially fragment on impact.
Re: Scalar waves??
i agree but for the last part
with proper accoustic and limit layer control, it's actually the shockwave that's enduring the pressure, not the material itself. resonnance stuff can be pretty interesting.
it's obviously the basis of the whole panzer kunst oscillation material
with proper accoustic and limit layer control, it's actually the shockwave that's enduring the pressure, not the material itself. resonnance stuff can be pretty interesting.
it's obviously the basis of the whole panzer kunst oscillation material
Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes. (Oscar Wilde)
Corporations have no soul to save, and they have no body to incarcerate. (Baron Thurlow)
Corporations have no soul to save, and they have no body to incarcerate. (Baron Thurlow)
Re: Scalar waves??
In my opinion the reason for the Sword of Damocles to employ Scalar waves has nothing to do with particular choice of physical theory by Yukito but a plot based one. Any weapon with some sort of projectile of ray could easily be fended of stopped by Alita, she would only, the time that the projetille/ray would take to reach the arena would be an eternity for her. The Scalar wave on the other hand just out of nowhere burns the arena in every single point and the only one capable of saving the day is Don Fua with the void palm "force field".
I my opinion the whole stunt was designed for Alita depend on Don Fua and easing the fact that the Space Karate lost the fight completely.
Abraços,
I my opinion the whole stunt was designed for Alita depend on Don Fua and easing the fact that the Space Karate lost the fight completely.
Abraços,
Re: Scalar waves??
Well maybe not scalar waves but you have those gamma ray emiters that kill tumors in your brains from multiple weaker sources.
You could imagine abbadon working the same way by making the energy converge from a distance.
You could imagine abbadon working the same way by making the energy converge from a distance.
Re: Scalar waves??
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/physics/fa ... bric-space
I feel like this is the most easily digestible science pill that outlines the idea that there is stuff in empty space. Kinda fun watching I think. It is the most current scientifically relevant as of this date.
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/cienc ... grid09.htm
seems old and a bit "ufo-watcher-y", but it seems to be the idea that Yukito is hitting on based on the original ideas from Tesla.
Tesla invented radio.
Tesla was really smart.
Tesla had some ideas that didn't really pan out, but they were necessary steps towards current understandings we hold true, that will also probably not pan out in some ways some day.
I also feel that Don Fua's body's component related to D-Theory, the D-Ripper, is related to all of this, a la Trinidad's quote,
"It (the Sword of Damocles, scalar waves) was built to prove D-Theory, an element of unified field theory, but the results were so unexpected that even its creation was erased from history...
The D-Ripper in Don Fua's body was originally developed as part of the gene plan..
...
It was hoped that it would be able to harvest infinite energy from the vacuum of space..."
"infinite energy from the vacuum of space" is definitely where that Nova episode goes.
Also, Syndrome, from "The Incredibles", his special, cool device that grabs the Incredibles is what he calls "Zero-Point-Energy".
I think the original poster would be happier if Yukito called the "Scalar Waves" "Zero Point Energy" instead.
I feel like this is the most easily digestible science pill that outlines the idea that there is stuff in empty space. Kinda fun watching I think. It is the most current scientifically relevant as of this date.
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/cienc ... grid09.htm
seems old and a bit "ufo-watcher-y", but it seems to be the idea that Yukito is hitting on based on the original ideas from Tesla.
Tesla invented radio.
Tesla was really smart.
Tesla had some ideas that didn't really pan out, but they were necessary steps towards current understandings we hold true, that will also probably not pan out in some ways some day.
I also feel that Don Fua's body's component related to D-Theory, the D-Ripper, is related to all of this, a la Trinidad's quote,
"It (the Sword of Damocles, scalar waves) was built to prove D-Theory, an element of unified field theory, but the results were so unexpected that even its creation was erased from history...
The D-Ripper in Don Fua's body was originally developed as part of the gene plan..
...
It was hoped that it would be able to harvest infinite energy from the vacuum of space..."
"infinite energy from the vacuum of space" is definitely where that Nova episode goes.
Also, Syndrome, from "The Incredibles", his special, cool device that grabs the Incredibles is what he calls "Zero-Point-Energy".
I think the original poster would be happier if Yukito called the "Scalar Waves" "Zero Point Energy" instead.