This forum really died.. NEW TOPIC (off topic to BAA)

[Snailygoat]

I don't know if I can start a topic about something off topic from BAA so I'll just see how it goes and hopefully we can have a
"mature and grown up" discussion here.

Can someone explain to me why everyone loves One Piece so much?
I'll start by saying it looks like something that should be aired between Hey Arnold and Phineas and Ferb on Disney.
The animations and drawings look completely childish and well.. S*** and its apparently aimed at a teenaged audience.
Everyone says the story is great and well explained and I'm sure it is because its obviously very successful.
I AM NOT saying anything about Naruto or Bleach being better (because thats what people will say to me later i can feel it)

One person in my class who revolves his life around One Piece says I would be hooked by episode 50...
Now most of my series I love go up to about 52 before they are complete. 50 episodes is nearly a full day of nonstop watching.
So I watched one episode of the anime SUBBED because apparantly the dubs were raped in America but I wont get into a talk about that. anyway the subbed version to me was just...I felt like i turned on a cartoon my 4 year old cousin might like. I would go on but... lets hear what other people have to say about this

*Ducks behind a wall as the OP fans roll in with the intent to KILL*

[Sergio Nova]

Thus, I must be an alien.

1. I DO NOT read One Piece;
2. I DO NOT read Bleach;
3. I DO NOT read Naruto.

Your questions have been answered since the beginnings of the time. Popular culture comes and go. What remains is considered "classical". The same happens in literature (in ten years, nobody will be interested in Dan Brown, the same way nowadays nobody is interested in Marion Zimmer Bradley), in music (does anyone remember KC & Sunshine Band?) and cinema (Kevin Costner? What are you talking about, man?).

If your taste differs from most of people, there is a great probability that you require superior quality, simply. Unfortunately, this has NEVER been the rule.


Ducks behind a wall as the OP fans roll in with the intent to KILL

Now, it is my turn to ask: what are you talking about, man?

[Snailygoat]

Thus, I must be an alien.

1. I DO NOT read One Piece;
2. I DO NOT read Bleach;
3. I DO NOT read Naruto.

Your questions have been answered since the beginnings of the time. Popular culture comes and go. What remains is considered "classical". The same happens in literature (in ten years, nobody will be interested in Dan Brown, the same way nowadays nobody is interested in Marion Zimmer Bradley), in music (does anyone remember KC & Sunshine Band?) and cinema (Kevin Costner? What are you talking about, man?).

If your taste differs from most of people, there is a great probability that you require superior quality, simply. Unfortunately, this has NEVER been the rule.


Ducks behind a wall as the OP fans roll in with the intent to KILL

Now, it is my turn to ask: what are you talking about, man?

What I mean is that I'm wondering how something like One Piece is such a popular release and its aimed at teenaged boys however
the animation looks terrible and from what I hear about the story, laughable.
Whenever I have see a forum about One Piece compared to the other manga releases, it's like they defend it like their child. So I have been hesitant to ask because I would get into some kind of huge debate where I'M the idiot who clearly has no taste apparently..

I am glad to find someone who has not obliderated me regarding this post. And yes what you said about quality is also quite true.
I don't see how such poor quality and endlessly dragged on series can be so popular. I must be a complete opposite in popular culture because about 90% of my movies are from the 80s and I even watch some from 50s onwards.

"Your questions have been answered since the beginnings of the time. Popular culture comes and go."
Now I'm hoping for the next thing to "come" that its gonna be someone picking up the original Gunnm series and realizing that its VERY good. And then it becomes the next big thing. However seeing what people find the most interesting about rubber pirates or kid ninjas I don't see Gally rising to the top of the world for a while

So on a side note Sergio. What do you read?

[Sergio Nova]

I had already understood your points. My question, in a jocular tone, was about your last phrase: Ducks behind a wall as the OP fans roll in with the intent to KILL. I really cannot understand it.

What do I read? Well, about contemporary mangas, I certainly read BAA, obviously, and also Black Lagoon. I had promised crazyankan that I was going to read Berserk. Actually, I already have the entire collection, but I still have to do it, then I will remake my opinion (or not).

A very interesting manga is the 3-volume Australian The Dreaming, by Queenie Chan. It is a sort of shôjo manga, but it goes far beyond shôjo, as it has narrative quality. So, you have a western reading and English language manga written and drew by an Australian-Chinese artist. Unfortunately, this is the only work of hers I know.

What would I recommend?
Alan Moore (anything)
Frank Miller (anything)
Akira (the only work I have read from Katsuhiro Otomo)
Blood+ (I did not like the original series, but the second one is interesting, completely restructured and written by different authors)
Nein Gaiman (anything)
Eden (simply great)
Naoki Urasawa (admirable, especially Monster and 20th Century Boys, but not only)

That is what I can remember now.


Oh, yes: Tarot Café, by the Korean Sang-Sun Park is a good work if you do not mind with her obsession in drawing every male as a transvestite.

[TheNefariousImp]

As a semi-closeted fan of One Piece, I'll put in my 2 cents. First, I'll just mention that I cannot stand to watch the anime. The pacing is terrible, the animation is uneven in quality, and many of the fights that lasted maybe 4 pages in the manga have been stretched to fill up entire episodes. It was made more bearable by the fact that instead of fansubs, I watched some HK pirated copies with hilariously bad English subtitles. Characters like Ussop were renamed things like Jesus-buu (wtf?) which led to some hilarious broken English dialogue.

Now, as for the manga, I began reading it nearly a decade ago when scanlations brought it to it's early popularity here in the U.S. It was years off before the American Shounen Jump magazine or the 4-kids dub came out. At first, I found it to be an amusing, bizarre shounen story with some cool fights, nothing too serious. I also enjoyed the early story arcs of Naruto and Bleach, they were reminiscent of classic shounen series like Flame of Recca, DBZ, and Yu Yu Hakusho, but without being overly derivative of the genre (oh god how that changed quick though). One Piece, despite it's predictable pacing, kept it's charm, but about 5 years ago I lost interest. After a 3 year hiatus I found a website hosting the whole series and decided to pick it up again. It started slow like it had, but in recent story arcs, after over 10 years in publication, the series finally starts fleshing out an interesting overarching plotline and sets a clearer end goal for the characters. So now I'm hooked again. It still has the same light-hearted feel to it, with added drama and peril, but now has a more focused storyline now that the creator has seemingly decided to speed the series pace up by quite a bit. Plus at the moment it's the only manga I'm reading that has a set schedule, as Berserk and Gunnm keep going on long hiatuses and such (I seriously need to pick Gantz up again).

So to address the OP, I have this to say: never listen to a fanboy about his favorite series and what will "hook you." They are too far up their own asses to give a reasonable recommendation. The series doesn't get truly interesting until about the Alabasta story arc, which is quite a ways into the series (I think somewhere around episode 110 maybe?). And even then, it takes about 100 chapters before we get some real plot progression (maybe more, I forget, it's a long fucking series). I mean, if you don't like shounen series at all, you're never going to enjoy One Piece. It follows most of the shounen conventions, yet has it's own unique art and storytelling style, which I think is why it has such a mass appeal. It's just different enough to outshine the 90% of godawful manga/anime that pervades Japanese media. And hell, if you don't like the art style, well, oh well. It wasn't meant to be a mature series, nor was it meant to be a children's only series. I find that it keeps the traditional anime art style while incorporating a more western look. This makes sense seeing that Eiichiro Oda's inspiration is drawn heavily from western pirate figures as well as viking legends, though he incorporates all sorts of other legends and figures from around the world. And possibly LSD.


Edit for important point forgotten in main post:
Almost all Shounen style series suffer from pacing flaws due to the nature of the Japanese comics industry. Series like Naruto, Bleach, and One Piece are often started without a complete plot-outline and the creators are pressured by the publisher to keep a popular series running past it's prime in order to suck every last dollar out of it. My theory is that Oda's insane success has given him enough clout to be able to do whatever he now wants with his series without editors hounding him and forcing him into shitty pacing, which is why the series has become fucking awesome in recent years. So, if you are going to read any shounen series, you must be prepared for the conventions and common flaws if you are to ever enjoy them. I'd recommend Flame of Recca to anyone wants a classic style shounen series that doesn't suffer from painful plot progression and overly stylistic storytelling. Or Yu Yu Hakusho since they are so damned similar.


Also, for the enoyment of fellow One Pieces fans on the board, I present the single greatest fan-made One Piece video/parody of an E-rotic video. NSFW: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqj4joaIrAg

[linefrog]

NefariousImp, I agree..
After reading and really enjoying One piece for years, it did seem to drag on, and it really meanders sometimes..
But the last year or so has been pretty good, it looks like it is back on track ( what with the Whitebeard hijinks and everything). It's still fun to read, not as story focused as Naruto, but not as buggered as Bleach.
You've got to remember they are main stream shonen manga, they have a few days to punch out 16 pages of plot and art, and are often at the whim of their audience and editors..
Manga like GLO, Blade of the immortal and Berserk will never sell as many tankobons as headline Jump title might, and they're fairly leisurely with the release rate ( though they stil manage to put out a lot of work in one month, and 9 times out of ten, it's quality art..)

Sergio, Queenie Chan is an acquaintance of mine and part of a group of artists that sometimes get together in Sydney ( the scene is a lot smaller there, obviously) She's also worked on a graphic novel featuring a character, Brother Odd, created by an american author called Dean Koontz.
http://www.amazon.com/Odd-Our-Side-Dean ... 376&sr=1-1
I don't think she had much to do with the plot, it received fairly mid-range reviews so I don't know if it'd be what you are looking for.
if you like her art, or like the character, it may be worthwhile..

[TargaryenX]

I think you're being a little quick to judge the series Snaily. The entire appeal of One Piece is that it doesn't take itself too seriously. It's a manga that all ages can enjoy (and do in Japan). That's not to say it doesn't have its powerful moments though. The characters are all likable (even though some might annoy you at first) and have a real role in the story. The plot is well-constructed and deals with surprisingly mature themes at times. Unlike many long-running shounen, Oda has a clear direction for his story. Sometimes you even see things that he set up like 200 chapters earlier, meaning that he doesn't just pull it out of his ass on a weekly basis.

I agree that the art is a little off-putting at first, and the series definitely requires a large time investment that might not be worth it for everyone. If you really want to find out what all the fuss is about, you'll just have to read the first few arcs with an open mind, and I promise if you like shounen at all you won't regret it. If you don't want to do that, then at least have the decency to not dismiss it out of hand as a dumb kid's manga.

[crazyankan]

If this ain't BAA + BAALO, it should be under the Users corner

//moved