001 3° serie spoiler alert ⚠

[kuroro86]

I started the new topic so we can have start discussions


By messiah I mean the usual story of the chosen one that was predicted in a ancient story. LOOK jesu Herry Potter, Neo, etc.... you remember the picture of the woman standing on top of a man? It looked to me like "the one great ( woman) to come and save us all. AND than in the last page they have a picture of Alita baby and they seem looking for her as she is special

[litchi master]

ok so this is what you meant, we are on the same page then.
I don't think this is where this is going, 28 volumes in the series there is going to be an out of nowhere prophecy? highly unlikely.
moreover from what we have seen so far Alita /Yoko is not well considered tzai crow despises her (as a failure both as a fighter and member of the kammer gruppe), And from what we know she must be the most hated criminal in history after doctor warez. (both by normal people for her actions as a terrorist and by the kunstlers because she was caught and thus caused the destruction of the Grunthal)
However as this is a common trope, and people tend to make prophecies for whatever reasons we might have something like that along the way.
something along the lines of "a chosen kunstler shall bring change"

[Sam]

Well, that's fine with me.
It's not like the previous works of nehei where you're basically following a nobody achieving something almost irrelevant (blame, biomega) in an innevitable consequential environnement.
I think we all knew from the start that following the story of Yoko, she would have something special, I mean seriously, she basically resurrected at least three times!!

Plus the german title says it all : "The queen of Mars", it's like the queen of the damned, the one with whom everything starts and ends (mostly) !

[Sam]

At least we have something new and interesting to talk about.

I thought this story would be about Yoko getting to mars after the ZOT, but then it looks like it's gonna be about her past life 'till the end of hers.

I just hope this won't be a 15 actual years story again...

[kuroro86]

I think this is going to be the story for a few chapters, just to give Alita a standing as Mars Queen. So she doesn't look like a conqueror.

I always liket Alita as an Outsider. I can see the interest on giving her a nice happy ending by giving her a faily to belong to. But I just feel is to simple as a story line

[litchi master]

a standing as Mars Queen?
I sure hope not! I read the script for the Gunnm martian memories video games and this was the thing I had most problems about.
You cannot imagine how relieved I was when I saw that Limeila didn't look like Alita one bit, and that this was not where the story was going.
Now about the two afore mentioned elements the picture of the the martian ruler and the fact that the guy has a picture of baby yoko.
the first may be a way to lead us to understand that women are the ones who usually rule Mars, making it a "gynocratia"(don't know if the word exists) as opposed to planets governed by men. So this sets this society apart in more than one way. Or this may simply be an Allegory, the woman standing for the wisdom of the martian ruler.
Secondly, the guy may be looking for Alita for a totally different reason, which is Still mysterious to us.

[Sam]

If we follow the fact that usually the reign of a king or queen is passed by blood, considering the fact that Yoko is a soldier, she could never be a queen.

That guy (and I must say, guys, your eyes at decrypting the scans are really good!) who has a picture of young Yoko might just well be part of her family, I don't expect her to be born from the DNA-orgue from Zalem (or that would be really clever from Yukito to introduce a glitch in the matrix ), she must have been born from a person.

[kuroro86]

That guy (and I must say, guys, your eyes at decrypting the scans are really good!) who has a picture of young Yoko might just well be part of her family, I don't expect her to be born from the DNA-orgue from Zalem (or that would be really clever from Yukito to introduce a glitch in the matrix ), she must have been born from a person.

I must say the idea of the family didn't came in my mind, mostly because that would be the family of the of the brain-alita, and not chip-alita.

BTW do we what to start talking about brain-alita as Yoko to avoid confusion?

BTW someone talked about German part, anyone can tell what is about?

[litchi master]

Well to answer different topics in one post

First as far as I am concerned Brain Alita and chip alita used to be one and the same person so as far as I am concerned they share the same childhood so unless we talk about a later part of the story there is no reason to differentiate the two.

Now about Yoko and royalty.
this one is tricky, well kingship is passed on by blood but not only, you can become King by way of conquest, or if you are acknowledged by the people for your deeds. Early Germanic Kingship worked that way: the role of the King was held by two people the rex who had a religious/ spiritual role and led the people in peace time. While the dux who was a war leader who was chosen on merit to lead the tribe to war. As time went by an individual would often assume both roles at the same time leading to the modern concept of kinship.

So If the reigning dynasty became extinct are chose to abdicate, Yoko could become Queen of Mars if the people chose her because of some deed she had performed.

But this is where it becomes tricky

Spoiler:

If you have read the gunnm martian memories script, you know there used to be a connection between Yoko and The Martian royal family, as there is no proof yet that kishiro has dropped this Idea though Limeila's appearance seems to indicate so. As well as the fact that the picture of the martian ruler represents a blonde woman who's got nothing to do with alita

[Sam]

As for the martian memories script, I've always thought that Yukito will end up doing it in the manga.
For me he made this script during the time the manga was over (after the first series) and that it was the story he always planned to do at first.

So, in my case, I would read it in the case the story has no end for whatever reason, for now I try to avoid it.

I thought there was a topic on the forum with the script of it, but can't find it anymore...

[litchi master]

here is the link to the script
http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/game/197512.html

and here is the page where you can find it on the forum
http://forum.rippersanime.info/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=336

[litchi master]

Now I chose to post 2 different posts to put an emphasis on the links to the script of the video game.
I also think that eventually Kishiro will make something out of this script, but he uses it more as a loose guide line to base his work on rather than an actual script.
If you just read the part about Ketheres /jeru it is quite different.
M'badi is called potemkin and he is positive character, caerula does not exist, her role is assumed by a character called Gallued whose body is actually a fizziroy body. sechs elf and zwolf don't exist and hejoa hopper only appears later.
These are only a few examples as Kishiro has had years to work on his script and flesh it out, and I must say I am glad he did, Last order is far more interesting than his previous script ever was. However he may not have changed the ending so I can only advise you not to read the part of the script about Mars if you don't want any spoiler.

Some of my theories are based on my knowledge of the script, so that's why I may put spoiler alerts to avoid revealing things unwittingly.

[Sam]

thanks, I'll have a look at it in case of!

BTW, in the chapter, her name is written with an 'H' below the picture? Pretty strange...
Translating yoko from kanji to romaji wouldn't make it appear, so I suppose this is how Yukito wanted it to be written from the beginning?

[kuroro86]

Hey got a really looooooooooooooooong shot.

The guys in the last pages. Are friends of the dead guy, and they stuck a little knife in his brain to recover some info from his brain. And the find Alita ^^
I noticed the small think he got in his head. But he got killed from a shotgun in the mouth

And the queen is not a premonition but simply the desire of the little bitch

[litchi master]

nice kuroro
I think you may be right for the knife thing which may be a device to retrieve information from deceased soldiers.
I looks a little peculiar, the handle is too short, maybe it is a linked to the computer of the guy in the cowboy hat.

Now why would someone be looking for Yoko?
Maybe the guy is a family member/ relative/ friend of the family's, though I tend to doubt that, the guy looks like bad news and the cowboy hat character and his goon look shady.

Maybe Yoko is the daughter of an important person and those guys are looking for her on that person's behalf or in order to ask for a ransom.
Maybe she has witnessed a crime and they want to silence her.

maybe she has got something very important hidden in her body that these guys want to retrieve.

maybe she is the Chosen one through the power of plot convenience after 28 volumes!!!!!

maybe these guys are looking for reasons yet unbeknownst to the author himself, just because of you know, suspense and all that.

[Sergio Nova]

Now about the two afore mentioned elements the picture of the the martian ruler and the fact that the guy has a picture of baby yoko.
the first may be a way to lead us to understand that women are the ones who usually rule Mars, making it a "gynocratia"(don't know if the word exists) as opposed to planets governed by men. So this sets this society apart in more than one way. Or this may simply be an Allegory, the woman standing for the wisdom of the martian ruler.

The word would be gynocracy, according to etymology, but anyway, I don't believe it is the case. As an example we have Britain, where in a certain moment we had a woman reigning and another woman governing, but the régime is a democracy, anyway, so that was not exactly extraordinary, and men were not ejected from power. A gynocracy would be the opposite of phallocracy, and that exists only in Arab world nowadays. There are males in positions of command on Mars as well, so they are neither a gynocracy nor a phallocracy, I think.

[kuroro86]

Now about the two afore mentioned elements the picture of the the martian ruler and the fact that the guy has a picture of baby yoko.
the first may be a way to lead us to understand that women are the ones who usually rule Mars, making it a "gynocratia"(don't know if the word exists) as opposed to planets governed by men. So this sets this society apart in more than one way. Or this may simply be an Allegory, the woman standing for the wisdom of the martian ruler.

The word would be gynocracy, according to etymology, but anyway, I don't believe it is the case. As an example we have Britain, where in a certain moment we had a woman reigning and another woman governing, but the régime is a democracy, anyway, so that was not exactly extraordinary, and men were not ejected from power. A gynocracy would be the opposite of phallocracy, and that exists only in Arab world nowadays. There are male in positions of command on Mars as well, so they are neither a gynocracy nor a phallocracy, I think.

I actually think the word is Matriarchy buuuuuut. I do re-call another conversation we had regarding the political situation of Mars. And that as far as we knew it's mess. there are other nation fighting there.

Let's remeber Mars Has now a Queen Limeira and she has the throne becouse her daddy died , we have no knoledge of her mother.

I still belive that picture was the dream of that little girl.

But maybe we are to close to call it. I think Yukito Kishiro is trying to get in the girl-revolutionary trend that we have now at Hollywood. And I don't know a lot about the other thinks he created about Mars, but I belive he has a lot of space to mandle with.

BTW any one knows where are our translators?

[Sergio Nova]

I actually think the word is Matriarchy buuuuuut. I do re-call another conversation we had regarding the political situation of Mars. And that as far as we knew it's mess. there are other nation fighting there.

I will have to check that conversation. It was a long time ago.
I am not an expert in politics, far from that, but it seems to me that matriarchy is a social, not political, system. That said, it may exist in a democracy or whatever.

[kuroro86]

You know I belive that conversation was mainly between you and me.

And I do belive you are right Matriarchy is a social system and applyed to politics only in the early days of human civilization.

[Sergio Nova]

And I do belive you are right Matriarchy is a social system and applyed to politics only in the early days of human civilization.

That makes sense. In ancient times, before morals rules and the like, the mothers (matriarchs) were the great responsible for raising children. There was no marriage and there was no alimony either. Well, I am stating to consider the possibility of resurrecting that.

[kuroro86]

And I do belive you are right Matriarchy is a social system and applyed to politics only in the early days of human civilization.

That makes sense. In ancient times, before morals rules and the like, the mothers (matriarchs) were the great responsible for raising children. There was no marriage and there was no alimony either. Well, I am stating to consider the possibility of resurrecting that.

You can move here :
http://www.mapsofworld.com/around-the-w ... archy.html

For the rest of the world I think is impossible

[Sergio Nova]

Well, in the rest of the world, or at least in Western world, women are usually pro-matriarchy when referring about their right on the children, even impeding the fathers to see their offspring, but always requiring alimony and such things.
Don't get me wrong! I do agree that fathers are responsible for their children, even because women do not have babies by themselves (although some would certainly love the idea), but I believe that fathers are supposed to have more rights to love and enjoy their children, and that is much more than giving money. Unfortunately, in the most different countries I know, in many cases women are experts in educating children against the fathers. Sad but real!

And, no, it is not my personal case (thanks God!).

[litchi master]

Sorry I didn't know the term existed so I went and coined something I thought would be understood by all. I was really over enthusiastic and didn't think about checking(a rea shame as the word does exist in French too, you are never too old to learn), I just thought that it would be interesting to see what Kishiro's take on "GYNOCRACY" would be. But you are right Limeila's father was King before m'Badi had him killed so my theory is invalidated.

[kuroro86]

What is the official english name of the 3° series?

[Sergio Nova]

What is the official english name of the 3° series?

To Know the official name you'll have to wait for Kodansha to announce it, but once it is already written "Gunnm Mars Chronicle" in the Japanese edition…